If it's crap... We'll tell you
How to kill and eat an internet troll
Hey gang,
I know it's been a while since I've written, but there's something that needs to be addressed. There has been a situation as of late that has drawn all of our attention. And it has drawn ALL of OUR attention. Not because we find it interesting or pertinent. But because people keep posting about it. Over and over again. Yes. We've all seen the videos. Yes. We know who this guy is. If we haven't commented there's probably a reason for it. Okay?
But there's a lesson to be found here. A couple, actually. In my decade as an online film critic, I've dealt with my fair share of trolls. Hell, trolls have been the least of my problems. Some guy with a youtube account is nothing compared to some of the shit I've had to stare down in my time. Angry studio heads, screaming directors, shyster publicity folks -- I've even had a few run ins with DAILYKOS. There are a few rules to dealing with guys like this; simple rules that are easy to learn if not slightly difficult to master. They are as follows:
1) DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS. You do not feed trolls - you starve them to death. A troll wants nothing more than attention, someone to listen to them because odds are no one in their real life does. They giggle at the idea of people getting mad and they rejoice in someone tangling with them. If you feed them, like a cat they will keep coming back at the same time every day waiting for more. You cannot win in a direct fight with a troll. Why?
2) No one ever wins an internet fight.
I have this printed out and hanging above my monitor. Why? For when things like this happen. I get ready to fire off a scathing response, look up, see that smiling face and remember rule number 1. You can go round and round all you want, but that's exactly what a troll wants: your attention.
3) The internet is like prison. Treat it as such and you'll be okay. Never make eye contact. Simple enough rule, right? It doesn't matter what the guy behind you says or does, if you don't make eye contact, they can't tell if you've been affected or not. The other night when the first video was posted, I shrugged it off and said "Well, as long as no one writes about this, we'll all be okay." The Leon posted about it. Guess what? Now you guys have been posting this endless screed on my page and subjecting me to it. Thanks. From the bottom of my heart.
4) Know your rights, but even better, know your Terms of Service. There is a common misconception that the 1st Ammendment protects you and allows you to say whatever the hell you want, whenever you want. This is actually not true. A close examination of the Bill Of Rights showcases an important first five words: CONGRESS SHALL MAKE NO LAW. You want to test this, go up to a cop and swear at him. Threaten to kick his ass. Odds are, depending on what state you're in, you're going to be arrested. Try threatening the president online...see how much the Bill of Rights protects you then. These rights are general, sweeping but not all inclusive.
Your freedom of speech does not extend to anywhere you are. If you swear or speak loudly in a restaurant, they have every right to kick you out. If you start talking politics in a store, they can throw your ass out. Start talking about the genius of NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN in my house...and I can kick you out. Same goes for server space. The owner of a server is responsible for whatever is stored on it and can delete whatever they please. Youtube has an extensive Terms of Service contract that most of you skipped through and clicked agree. If you read it, however, you will find that it is against youtube policy for you to use people's image, name or personal information without permission. If that person files a complaint, you have 48 hours to remove or amend the offending information or you will have your account terminated.
Those of you who flagged videos for us? Thank you. Now don't ever, ever do that again. You have potentially muddled issues with youtube. Read the ToS of any site you are having issues with. If and when a troll crosses the line, quickly and quietly deal with it without breaking any rules yourself. Nothing will anger a troll more than this...but there is little or nothing they can really do about it. Right now our Troll du Jour is claiming that he will take down the video as an "olive branch" if someone apologizes. The truth is he's taking it down or modifying it anyway. If he doesn't, he loses his precious youtube account.
Something tells me he's not going to allow that. He's having too much fun at your expense right now.
5) Don't poke the loony. This point cannot be stressed enough and while an offshoot of rule number 3, really needs to be hammered home. The situation we have here is one in which some of the guys humiliated a youtube user in a cruel display of mockery. I know, I know: if you post something on the internet, you should expect to be mocked. That doesn't make it right. That certainly doesn't excuse you when you do it. And it doesn't wipe you of blame when your buddies get dragged into it. Sure I've seen the guy's videos when you've posted them in the past. I watch a minute or two, find nothing worth watching the rest of and delete them, going merrily on my way. Really, why make fun of the guy? Why troll him because I don't like what he has to say or think that he sounds like an idiot saying it? I understand the guys find that kind of thing funny, but I don't. Especially when my inbox and comment wall fill up with shit I don't care about.
So the long and the short of it? Leave this guy alone. And if for some inexplicable reason you can't, don't post it on my board or send it to me. I. Don't. Care. Some of you have really let me down this week. By egging this guy on, by calling him a retard, flaming and stalking him, you've had him call me out. Not you. Thanks for that. From the bottom of my heart. Remember, when you go on other boards and speak for Spill...in the eyes of onlookers you are speaking for Spill. Remember that. Just as this guy has made his Talkback friends look bad, imagine what some of you have done for us.
I know it's been a while since I've written, but there's something that needs to be addressed. There has been a situation as of late that has drawn all of our attention. And it has drawn ALL of OUR attention. Not because we find it interesting or pertinent. But because people keep posting about it. Over and over again. Yes. We've all seen the videos. Yes. We know who this guy is. If we haven't commented there's probably a reason for it. Okay?
But there's a lesson to be found here. A couple, actually. In my decade as an online film critic, I've dealt with my fair share of trolls. Hell, trolls have been the least of my problems. Some guy with a youtube account is nothing compared to some of the shit I've had to stare down in my time. Angry studio heads, screaming directors, shyster publicity folks -- I've even had a few run ins with DAILYKOS. There are a few rules to dealing with guys like this; simple rules that are easy to learn if not slightly difficult to master. They are as follows:
1) DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS. You do not feed trolls - you starve them to death. A troll wants nothing more than attention, someone to listen to them because odds are no one in their real life does. They giggle at the idea of people getting mad and they rejoice in someone tangling with them. If you feed them, like a cat they will keep coming back at the same time every day waiting for more. You cannot win in a direct fight with a troll. Why?
2) No one ever wins an internet fight.
I have this printed out and hanging above my monitor. Why? For when things like this happen. I get ready to fire off a scathing response, look up, see that smiling face and remember rule number 1. You can go round and round all you want, but that's exactly what a troll wants: your attention.
3) The internet is like prison. Treat it as such and you'll be okay. Never make eye contact. Simple enough rule, right? It doesn't matter what the guy behind you says or does, if you don't make eye contact, they can't tell if you've been affected or not. The other night when the first video was posted, I shrugged it off and said "Well, as long as no one writes about this, we'll all be okay." The Leon posted about it. Guess what? Now you guys have been posting this endless screed on my page and subjecting me to it. Thanks. From the bottom of my heart.
4) Know your rights, but even better, know your Terms of Service. There is a common misconception that the 1st Ammendment protects you and allows you to say whatever the hell you want, whenever you want. This is actually not true. A close examination of the Bill Of Rights showcases an important first five words: CONGRESS SHALL MAKE NO LAW. You want to test this, go up to a cop and swear at him. Threaten to kick his ass. Odds are, depending on what state you're in, you're going to be arrested. Try threatening the president online...see how much the Bill of Rights protects you then. These rights are general, sweeping but not all inclusive.
Your freedom of speech does not extend to anywhere you are. If you swear or speak loudly in a restaurant, they have every right to kick you out. If you start talking politics in a store, they can throw your ass out. Start talking about the genius of NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN in my house...and I can kick you out. Same goes for server space. The owner of a server is responsible for whatever is stored on it and can delete whatever they please. Youtube has an extensive Terms of Service contract that most of you skipped through and clicked agree. If you read it, however, you will find that it is against youtube policy for you to use people's image, name or personal information without permission. If that person files a complaint, you have 48 hours to remove or amend the offending information or you will have your account terminated.
Those of you who flagged videos for us? Thank you. Now don't ever, ever do that again. You have potentially muddled issues with youtube. Read the ToS of any site you are having issues with. If and when a troll crosses the line, quickly and quietly deal with it without breaking any rules yourself. Nothing will anger a troll more than this...but there is little or nothing they can really do about it. Right now our Troll du Jour is claiming that he will take down the video as an "olive branch" if someone apologizes. The truth is he's taking it down or modifying it anyway. If he doesn't, he loses his precious youtube account.
Something tells me he's not going to allow that. He's having too much fun at your expense right now.
5) Don't poke the loony. This point cannot be stressed enough and while an offshoot of rule number 3, really needs to be hammered home. The situation we have here is one in which some of the guys humiliated a youtube user in a cruel display of mockery. I know, I know: if you post something on the internet, you should expect to be mocked. That doesn't make it right. That certainly doesn't excuse you when you do it. And it doesn't wipe you of blame when your buddies get dragged into it. Sure I've seen the guy's videos when you've posted them in the past. I watch a minute or two, find nothing worth watching the rest of and delete them, going merrily on my way. Really, why make fun of the guy? Why troll him because I don't like what he has to say or think that he sounds like an idiot saying it? I understand the guys find that kind of thing funny, but I don't. Especially when my inbox and comment wall fill up with shit I don't care about.
So the long and the short of it? Leave this guy alone. And if for some inexplicable reason you can't, don't post it on my board or send it to me. I. Don't. Care. Some of you have really let me down this week. By egging this guy on, by calling him a retard, flaming and stalking him, you've had him call me out. Not you. Thanks for that. From the bottom of my heart. Remember, when you go on other boards and speak for Spill...in the eyes of onlookers you are speaking for Spill. Remember that. Just as this guy has made his Talkback friends look bad, imagine what some of you have done for us.
Comment
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Comment by Bayley on July 9, 2009 at 4:09pm - I haven't been able to get on this side for . . . a few weeks now :( What did I miss?
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Comment by Luke Veinot on July 1, 2009 at 11:07pm - thanks
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Comment by ColinZero on July 1, 2009 at 9:48pm -
Ghostwriter, similar to what Carlyle mentioned, it all depends upon the terms of service of the particular site it's being posted on. While some may allow it, much of it isn't so much the legal side of it so much as what the site itself chooses to allow you to post. They're under no obligation to host something anyone posts. And if they don't like it, they don't have to host it.
The legalities of someone putting up a photo of you on their own site, or one that just doesn't care, is slightly different though. In a situation like that you pretty much have to outright prove the photo was stolen, and typically that just boils down to purely state to state regulation on whether or not any harm has been done.
It's all really weird and almost entirely circumstantial depending upon where it's been put up. At any rate,hope this helped!
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Comment by ghostwriter on July 1, 2009 at 3:04pm -
What I don't understand is this:
Now, I found that pic of Carlyle way back last year on the WWW when I first joined Spill. I didn't post it anywhere, I was just curious to see what these guys looked like. If the picture is on the net, doesn't that make it Public Domain? How can you stop someone from using an image of you that's on another site? I'm not saying he's wrong, far from it. Everyone has a right to privacy, even public figures and celebrities. I just don't understand the legal side of this, that's all.
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Comment by RemiCorps on July 1, 2009 at 2:50pm -
Amen to the, Carlyle.
Do NOT give them attention and they will go away.
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Comment by Mad Man Mick on July 1, 2009 at 1:26pm -
Some of you have really let me down this week. By egging this guy on, by calling him a retard, flaming and stalking him, you've had him call me out. Not you. Thanks for that. From the bottom of my heart. Remember, when you go on other boards and speak for Spill...in the eyes of onlookers you are speaking for Spill. Remember that. Just as this guy has made his Talkback friends look bad, imagine what some of you have done for us.
Damn man I'm sorry. I feel like a shit head now. I got wrangled by an internet troll, I'm sorry man.
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Comment by JC on July 1, 2009 at 12:16pm -
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Comment by ragman on July 1, 2009 at 11:38am -
Carlyle I have to disagree with you about the freedom of speech stuff because that's mostly your interpretation of what's written in the constitution rather then what is actually true. I'm not saying that a restaurant shouldn't kick someone out if they're being a jackass or you shouldn't kick someone out of your house if they're talking about no country for old men. However the whole example of kicking someone out of a store is a bad example and something someone can probably sue over.
The point that I could see you were trying to make is that anyone on the internet has the right to do whatever it is with their terms of service. But bringing in freedom of speech confuses the issue because the internet is not just something that is limited to the united states. People access this, and other sites, in countries where there isn't freedom of speech. So when some people say that a law strictly for the united states protects everyone from terms of service that's BS.
In short, you didn't have to go on about freedom of speech when the internet is not limited to one country.
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Comment by Jerry on July 1, 2009 at 9:21am - Hmm, I had planned to devote a webcomic to this guy on my site. You have inspired me to possibly rethink this. Although, he is comedy gold
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Comment by Fenrir Chisholm on July 1, 2009 at 8:03am -
matty: I was being facetious.. And as for his videos, I will agree that he isn't interested in debating personally. I have just known a number of previous trolls who not only were, but later turned out to be friends. And possible motivations aside, one cannot fully separate what he feels spill.com as a "personal" attack from his equally pressing desire to validate his own existence by being right. However, I still fail to see how spill.com owes him an apology over any supposed wrongs concerning the site and it's content.
If anything, the irony of this situation is that he has been the initial antagonist when the site does something he doesn't agree with or like, then try to claim the "high road" by being a self-appointed "defender of the armed forces" while wearing a fake military outfit. I feel sorry for him, because not only does he feel that he's the only one capable of being right in his cold, dark, little world, but his taste in movies is appalling and equally atrocious.
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