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Permalink Reply by Kimura-Triangle on May 28, 2009 at 3:34pm

Well, admittedly the point has come up that there are flaws in the US military system that allow these sort of things to happen. It's called the "Bad Barrel" principle (as opposed to just one or two bad apples). I mean, there are examples from almost every major war in the last fifty years of it: The Gulf War, 'Nam, Iraq, etc.

In particular, the last major one I can remember from Iraq was the video which a soldier shot of some of his... platoon? Squad? I'm not entirely sure, beating the living SHIT out of unarmed civilians while a bunch of the guys sat back and laughed. The effects of situations on people who would otherwise be perfectly just-minded people has been thoroughly studied, particularly in Zimbardo's Stanford School Experiment. There are tons of articles online about it in particular, which I highly recommend checking out. Numerous interviews following the incident I mentioned had soldiers talking about how it was far from a few "bad apples" showing that kind of behaviour, with it being more common than some would like to believe.

And before I get torn apart, I'd like to re-iterate that these soldiers are probably not bad people by any stretch of the imagination; there are simply flaws in the procedural system of military operations that often allow or even encourage this sort of behaviour, likely unintentionally, without strong enough repercussions as to stop it from happening. It's also possible that this is a result of soldiers taking combat conditioning to the extreme, combined with the stress of long-term combative situations. A great book for looking at that is On Killing by Dave Grossman, a former Lt. Col.

As for the question initially posed by Monkeybone; I think that the reason for these incidents getting minimal coverage is KIND OF what you're talking about, but more so because of the practical implications of something like that being proven. What kid is going to want to join the army where those sorts of things take place, IN ADDITION to being shot at on a daily basis? Not to mention how that kind of public knowledge would damper the government's ability to manufacture consent among the population for future military operations.

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Permalink Reply by Dolde on May 28, 2009 at 3:43pm

First it is the internet
the people that yell the loudest are usually the crazy people
people don't really like to talk about stuff like that a lot and that goes for every country

Personally i'm tired of so many people stereotyping everyone from the U.S.A like we are all Rush Limbaugh. I would say U.S. is criticized insanely by people from other countries. Incompetence and ignorance goes both ways.

Unfortunately the war has brought in lower standards of who can join the army and records show higher psychological and suicide problems upon return. Every country that has gone to war has had people rape and murder, but of course U.S. is the "celebrity" so we have to be perfect :S

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Permalink Reply by Kimura-Triangle on May 28, 2009 at 5:14pm

I don't think that it's the "celebrity" of it. Because of the "too close forcomfort" relationship between the administration and private business interests (best personified by the Bush administration), the US has gained a reputation for upholding alliances which best suit their business interests.

One need only look at the number of democratically elected leaders in various South American countries which have been assassinated, often by CIA-funded mercs (I mean, that's what inspired Che Guevara in the first place). Once more pliable leaders are placed in their stead, US based companies move in, and through buying up foreign land, they create an outflow of money from these countries towards the US. I'm not saying other developed countries don't do this as well, but the US is by far the biggest culprit for it, mostly because of the political and economic clout that your representatives hold in organizations like the UN, IMF, and World Bank. THAT's why other countries are so rash on America.

I'm not saying ignorance isn't also pervasive in any country, but there's more to it than just blind prejudice. I'm not for anti-americanism or anti-anycountryism, but it's often enlightening to look into the roots of such negative ideas.

In conclusion, no, you're not "the celebrity."

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Permalink Reply by Chig Champa on May 30, 2009 at 2:45am

I hate patriotism.

It was a round world, last time I checked.

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Permalink Reply by T.R. on May 31, 2009 at 11:32am

The only kind of patriotism is blind patriotism. One must realize that nations are run by people and not by ideals, people have faults.

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