Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Moxie on March 22, 2010 at 6:25pm

Now i REALLY wish could remember the guy's name, it would make this alot easier. I even did a bit of research to see if i could find it but i didnt have much luck (guess that's what happens when you get things from books instead of random websites). But i'll give it a try regardless.

It all connects to what it means to practice religion. As you know that doesn't always require a proclamation of a belief in a God or even a belief in a God period. Please understand that in the moment i am not talking about the big bad organized religion atheist and agnostic alike seem to hate so much. I am speaking of religion in general, or spirituality if that sits better with you. Faith is a religious/spiritual phenomenon it may be used in other context but it is a straight up product of religion. To clarify faith is "believing so that you may understand" (are you willing to work with me an accept that definition? i hope so). So that leads me to hope which i will say is faith directed towards the future. Hence the reason you cannot have hope without faith. Draw that line all the way back around to religion/spirituality.
To put it in a less philosophical sense, take Asia for example. They have a large population that many of you would consider "atheist" however they still live in a culture that uses and incorporates spirituality into their daily lives. They are able to do so with without an outward proclamation of a belief in a higher power or even an after life.
The base behind this theory is that everyone, even atheist, practice religion in some form. It is just that integrated into the human experience.

I am not super confident in my explanation of all that but i tired...just for you, because i dig ya Labby. :D

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Permalink Reply by Latter Day Heretic on March 23, 2010 at 5:20am

i would say religion is a by product of spirituality not the other way around.

personally i think you are grasping at straws on this one, yes it may be true that much of asia is considered 'atheist' but practise religion, but however that does not mean that western atheists practice religion, as lab rat said it involves rituals and other stuff, atheists don't do shit, there is a better argument that smoking weed is my religion, i spend far more money and time on that than atheism, i have my own little rituals, i get together with other stoner etc that might also effect my daily interaction with the world, while my atheism has no real effect on my day to day life.

i think the problem here is that you seem to not be able to separate your religion form any aspect of your life, your relationships, how you interact with the world, my self and lab rat do not have that problem. religion barely had any effect on my life when i was attending church, it was always something i had to do not wanted to do, it was always an after thought in my life between monday and saturday it had no place in my life.

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Permalink Reply by Moxie on March 23, 2010 at 10:09pm

Example of "westerners" practicing religion.
Do you celebrate Christmas in any form? Yes i realize it has become extremely commercialized and you dont celebrate it in the sense that you are celebrating the birth of Jesus. But it is a religious holiday and if you participate in any form one can make the claim that you are practicing religion. Even if it just because of a cultural expectation or family obligation.

Have you ever wished for something? Is that not a form of spirituality?

I knew when i brought this up that yall probably wouldnt agree with me.
But you are viewing this from the position that its a product of my own bias. I didnt come up with this its a theory held my theologists and these arent people bias towards one religion on the other, they are people who study religion and its effects on society.

Both believe in God and not believe in God are a choice. Despite how an individual may about their motivations...

Religion has never been important to you. So yea of course you can separate it from other aspects of your life. It is important to me. Like i said before God is the most important thing in my life and that is completely intentional. Just like any other thing i do that is a practice of my religion. I was never forced to go to church as a kid both back then and now it is something i do when i want to.

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Permalink Reply by Latter Day Heretic on March 24, 2010 at 3:15am

i don't think believing in god is a choice, either you do or you don't, some people are just not spiritual. i did not choice to not believe in god, i don't believe in god, there is a big difference.

regardless it still seem like a stretch to say i am practising religion it sound like the old, your not really an atheist you do really believe in god line i get from Christians quite a lot. regardless if it is a legitimate theory i still don't consider it a valid point, it seem to me like a cope out a way to say that you are religious what ever you do so there.

i am not saying that is what you are saying directly but its how it comes across to me, religion and eating and exchanging gifts because everyone else are is different. like duke said if it wasn't for everyone else i wouldn't notice or celebrate.

it might just be me but to me religion is not just something you do or participate in, is football a religion if i go every sunday?, there is something more to it, that's why its call religion and not participation.

oh and just one thing this isn't really aimed at you but you do know all the big 'Christian' holidays are pagan holidays, you are probably angering god by celebrating yule, or the spring, or harvest, i could make the case you practice paganism it is not true but i could make the case.

Permalink Reply by Latter Day Heretic on March 24, 2010 at 3:19am

when you said choose to believe that got me thinking, do you think you can choice to believe or not, is it that simple a thing.

not to put words in your mouth but to me that sound like religion is not some truth that some can see and other can't but a choice

you choose to believe in god because you want to, doesn't that seriously cheapen faith, that to me makes it dishonest.

but like i said, i don't think its something you can choose.

Permalink Reply by Gift of the Magi on March 26, 2010 at 5:47pm

LDH, yeah Christmas is based on Candlemas...and Easter is also a 'pagan' ritual (but look up the word pagan in the dicitonary...you might be surprised what it REALLY means). It's believed Christ might have really been born around June and we don't have any idea when the crusifiction actually happened.

Anyway, celebrating a holiday these days is more about having a day off work, hanging out with family and merchantize.

Permalink Reply by Latter Day Heretic on March 26, 2010 at 8:42pm

it was a stupid point, just ignore it.

i kind of went of subject with that comment

Permalink Reply by Chig Champa on March 26, 2010 at 8:49pm

Did somebody say Candlemass??


Oh, no... they said Candlemas... close enough!!

Permalink Reply by The Leo of Costa Rica on March 26, 2010 at 9:00pm

HoIy shit! I haven't seen that video in ages! That has to be the cheesiest music video in history.

...I still can't figure out how the hell did Messiah fit on that coffin.

Permalink Reply by The Eyeball Kid on March 22, 2010 at 3:05pm

With religion comes eons of tradition and communal support. Legitimate or not, religious communities act as a sort of extended family which provides support, inspiration, and yes, love. It's not coming from a deity, but from the people coming together in a shared experience.

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Permalink Reply by steven cowie on March 23, 2010 at 8:32am

RELIGION = CONTROL. why are we still arguing about this in the 21st century???

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Permalink Reply by rinema on March 25, 2010 at 7:27pm

Human is a very social creature and therefore the need for love and acceptance from others is essential. There is an importance in churches to bring people once a week to build strong communities made of family and friends and even acquaintances. However, I feel that it is unnecessary to pull together because of a deity/religion dictates them to do so. People I feel the time is better spent working or spending time with your family and friends or perhaps volunteering.

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